Tuesday, October 6, 2009

Continuing discussion

LK has a most interesting entry in her journal, entitled "I guess I'm not a Christian", and since I had some more thoughts, I figured I may as well do a post on it. : )

Like LK, I believe in evolution. I also believe in creationism. As circumstances (particularly environmental ones) change, everything has to adapt in order to survive.

This was my initial reply to her journal entry:

"In regards to your "nobody went to heaven before Jesus"...statement, I guess, is that the reason sacrifices were performed prior to Jesus' death was to obtain God's forgiveness of sin. Jesus is often called "the Lamb of God", and that pertains to his role as the final sacrifice. After He died, animal sacrifices were no longer necessary."

As far as the concept of "original sin", I'm like LK. I don't believe in it. That's why, in the church I was raised (the Church of Christ), baptism was a choice to be made by the individual when they were old enough to understand the need for it. Babies are born innocent, and young children can't really sin because they don't have the sense of right and wrong that adolescents and adults do. *Knowing* the difference between right and wrong is the key. Once you have that knowledge and wilfully do wrong, that's when you have sinned.

I've met many Christians who believe that Jesus IS God. I was always taught that He was the Son of God, the final sacrifice which would atone for our sins for eternity, if we were willing to believe in Him as the Son. As a man, Jesus experienced sorrow, anguish, love, fear, hope, etc. That's why He prayed in the garden for God to take the burden of the cross from Him. However, that was the reason for Jesus to be on Earth, and He submitted to the will of God, although He knew that He would be tortured, that the Father would turn His face from Jesus when the Son assumed responsibility for every sin that had been or would be committed, and that He would die. But He also knew He would rise on the third day.

The Christ I have always believed in was a man of peace and hope who delivered miracles and the message of salvation. For me, Christianity has always been a very simple faith to follow, because all that is required is that you believe. However, that is not carte blanche for you to do whatever you want and then say "Oh, I'm a Christian, so I'm forgiven." It doesn't work like that. Salvation is a gift that is freely given by God out of love for us, his children, but you try to be obedient to God's commandments and do good works AS A RESULT of salvation, not as a path TO salvation. Does that make sense?

I do believe that Jesus was the Son of God, sent by a loving God to be our savior, the final sacrifice. I don't believe that doing good works will get you into heaven -- as the verse says "for we all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God". It is only because of my loving Heavenly Father that I can be redeemed.

Well, I guess I could never be Muslim.

This has been an interesting journey. My searching for understanding in Islam has helped me to become a more spiritual person with a deeper, stronger faith than I have ever had in my life.

* * *

Okay, that's all I seem to have to say tonight. I've got some more "job preparation" stuff to do tomorrow, so I'll check back with you guys then. Have a good night!

17 comments:

  1. Interesting.

    One question - if there was no original sin, why do we sin? I'm just looking for what you think here, obviously. :)

    "However, that is not carte blanche for you to do whatever you want and then say "Oh, I'm a Christian, so I'm forgiven." It doesn't work like that. Salvation is a gift that is freely given by God out of love for us, his children, but you try to be obedient to God's commandments and do good works AS A RESULT of salvation, not as a path TO salvation."

    *nods* I completely agree. :)

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  2. I should have said that I don't agree with the Catholic (and other folks, too, I guess) concept that we are all born sinful because of Adam and Eve.

    We sin because we have free will -- to choose to follow God's commandments or not. Satan's greatest joy is to lure the righteous off the straight and narrow path, so he does his very best to hit us where he knows we're weak. He doesn't go after the people who are already doing wrong and don't repent of it, because they're already his. He's not worried about them.

    Satan makes doing wrong look like a good thing. How often to we see others do wrong, but they prosper out of it? (Temporarily, of course. It will come back to bite them in the collective booty eventually. ^_^) The grass is not greener on the other side, folks. It just looks that way until you get there, and then you see that it's all brown and dry.

    Because we aren't perfect, we make mistakes and sin, but that's one of the wonderful things about God --- He forgives us for that.

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  3. I enjoyed reading your views. Thanks for sharing them in this interesting post! :)

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  4. "The grass is not greener on the other side, folks. It just looks that way until you get there, and then you see that it's all brown and dry."

    Actually, it *is* greener, but that's just because there's more 'fertilizer' laying around on that side. ;)

    Since I don't believe there was an actual Adam and Eve, I'd have to agree that we aren't born sinful because of them, but still, there's a propensity to choose sin over good - that has to come from somewhere, and it can't have been God's Will - otherwise He's sort of setting some of us up for failure. Does that make sense? It's getting late and I've been inhaling fumes for half an hour here...

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  5. Amber, what do you think Adam and Eve symbolize then? I just can't help but think of references to Adam in the NT. Even in genealogies he is there, isn't he? *am thinking*

    Curious what you think. Thanks.

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  6. By the way, I love your new picture. That shiny hijab/niqab is super cute!

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  7. Humanity in general, really. We evolved with some 'help' from God.

    I'm of the opinion that God bumped us along at certain points, and gave us knowledge slowly, as we grew ready for it and the implications of it. At some point, the Devil (just a guy doin' his job here) tempted us with a 'short cut' and we thereby took ourselves out of the easy path that God had planned.

    Adam is referenced in the NT, sure. He was a 'type' of Christ. Just as Eve was a 'type' of Mary.

    And yes, Adam is referenced in geneologies in the NT. Doesn't make him a actual person. People used to reference Zeus and other gods in their gene pool. Didn't make them real either. :)

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  8. *grin* Thanks Heather. I picked that one up at Walmart actually. I saw it and thought of you and your purple hijab/niqab. :)

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  9. Wow lots of great observations. I will say one thing about religion.

    Choose what works for you in whatever form that may come. No one religion is right or wrong. If it brings you closer to God, then it is probably the right path for you whether it means Jesus as son, Jesus as sacrifice, Jesus as God, or Jesus as prophet. Or no Jesus at all. If it makes you feel whole and it makes you feel closer to God and at peace then you might have found what you are looking for.

    And that I find "just believe" to be the hardest thing about Christianity.

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  10. Amber, thanks for explaining that...interesting. I've never heard such things. So where do you think the true people start in the OT. If Adam and Eve are just types, where do the real human beings begin? Cain and Abel? Seth? Noah? Moses? Abraham? Jeremiah?

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  11. I'm my own person, that's for sure. :)

    I think Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jeremiah were all real people. Of course, I could be wrong. I could be wrong about Adam and Eve and Cain and Abel and Seth. And, honestly, I don't think it matters one way or the other. Whether or not any of these people were real doesn't affect my salvation.

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  12. Amber, you wrote: "And, honestly, I don't think it matters one way or the other. Whether or not any of these people were real doesn't affect my salvation."


    Right..I agree. I was more curious than anything. Didn't know where exactly you thought "real people" began as opposed to myths or symbolism or whatever. :) Thanks for answering my curious mind!


    :-D

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  13. Susanne,

    I'm always happy to indulge curiosity. I suffer from an excess of it myself, as you know. :)

    Also, just because they were real people (or so I believe) doesn't mean that the symbolic significance of the stories recounted to us isn't more important than the bare bones facts.

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  14. just have to say, such smart ladies :)

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  15. LK, I'm with you: I'm totally impressed by you guys! *hugs all you gals*

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  16. please dont hate me...but cant u consider once again?
    lol.

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